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antigraviddy
From: Taranaki
Since: May 2012
Posts: 23

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Is this film racist?

Care of the Manawatu Standard:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/manawatu-standard/news/7077599/Is-this-video-racist

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themorgan
From: Auckland
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 655

They've hidden the clip on YouTube, so I think someone realises they fucked up.

Seems like a pretty drastic move by UCOL, which wouldn't have been taken lightly.

Anyone seen it who cares to comment?

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Mista Teas
From: Christchurch
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 529

Plenty of comments under the article but alas private on YouTube (now).

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ryan
From: Wellington
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 237

Not racist but way too much attention on a film that doesn't really deserve it.

Was RyanM on the old forum.
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videoamp1969
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 122

Ryan how can you say that that was not racist are you blind!

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dmanthei
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 418

I didn't really think it was racist in any legitimately-outrageous way.
Culturally-insensitive with lots of stupidity throughout? Definitely.

I was more offended at the horrendous audio problems.

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sideshowstu
From: Queenstown
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 119

That film was pretty offensive. The racial stereotypes were very distasteful. Some people call that racism. Some people only classify race-hatred as racism. I think the film sucked regardless of whether they're racists or not. Shame on these guys for not knowing better.

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videoamp1969
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 122

The scene in the bar was totally offensive and only done to take the piss out of certain aspects of black culture. It played no effect part in the storyline except to cause offence. That is why its racist.

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ryan
From: Wellington
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 237

in reply to videoamp1969:

Racism is putting someone down because they are of a different race - or treating someone negatively because of it, if you are just dressing up as a different culture and acting silly then that is not racist, nor is playing on stereotypes, the intent behind it makes it racist or not.

Was RyanM on the old forum.
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dramamike
From: Wellington
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 1359

I thought that film was not a quality one at all.
If I disregard the race issue, just for a moment, the film was not a quality one.
If I then consider the race issue, it becomes a very poor, ill conceived one, that is not worth anything more than my time.

To those who were involved- C'mon guys, that was dumb, offensive and something you should not bother repeating.

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videoamp1969
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 122

in reply to ryan:

Ryan you have no idea, what your taking about. Im finished with this thread before I get really mad at people who are not educated enough to understand decades of oppression.
I have no problem with the chinese stereotyping which was in context, but the representation of the black guy at the bar was just gratuitous.
Ryan I challenge you to go into a bar in certain places and perform that particular scene, then find out if they think its racist!

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TIC - The Rowing Team "Wool they wake up?"
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Best Cinematography, Rialto Rising Talent, Best School Team)

2014 TIC - Proximity- "Relapse"
2014 TIC - Chookie- "The Diary of Morgan Foster"
2013 TIC - Procrasti Nation- "Joker" (City Winner - Incredibly Strange Best Bad Film)
2013 TIC - 2 Cameras 1 Film- "The Way Forward?" (Audience Favourite)
2013 TIC - Man Over The Fence- "Drama Queen"
2013 TIC - Is That Kaiapoi?!- "Inside The Mind"
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Peter Haynes
From: Auckland
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 89

Wait, you have no problem with the horribly offensive 1940's era fake chinese accent, but the black guy bothers you? Double standard much?

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videoamp1969
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 122

in reply to Peter Haynes:

Fair call Peter, its all down to personal perception. I have re watched it again and I am split 50/50 with that aspect. But we should not breathe any more wind into the fire, too hard to have a proper debate on such issues on this type of forum. But you have a relevant point and I accept that.

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2018 TIC - Silver Stars-"The Black Phantom"
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2017
TIC - The Three Shushes- "Damsel"
2017 TIC - Lame Name- "Logan the Bogan" (3rd Audience Favourite)
2017 TIC - Pingkee and The Pitts- "Fierce"
2016 TIC - Team Wannab- "Strings Attached" (City Winner -Spirit of the Competition Award. Nominated for; Best Make Up, Best School Team)
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2016
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2016
TIC - The Rowing Team "Wool they wake up?"
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mikedensem
From: Christchurch
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 346

in reply to videoamp1969:

The scene in the bar was totally offensive

Is the film on the stuff webpage the one we are talking about or is this an edited version?

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mikedensem
From: Christchurch
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 346

in reply to videoamp1969:

too hard to have a proper debate on such issues on this type of forum

I believe this type of forum is the best place for these debates as many of the film makers here are new to the film making. Identifying issues that can derail a film and giving objective criticism is the way they learn to do better work.

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-- Kitty Aye Aye Films - Survival (Fate): Best Day Ever
2016 - (Guardian for two school teams)
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ryan
From: Wellington
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 237

in reply to videoamp1969:

Well obviously if I was to do that I would be meaning to cause offence and looking for a fight, it's completely unrelated to what I was saying.

The concepts in the film might have been a bad idea, but they were not racist.

This film does not warrant anywhere near this kind of debate as it wasn't particularly good.

People take way too much offence over something that was done specifically to cause offence because these sorts of reactions are comical.

You are playing into the immature film makers hands.

Was RyanM on the old forum.
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themorgan
From: Auckland
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 655

in reply to ryan:

the intent behind it makes it racist or not.

That's not correct. If a naive child is raised by bigot parents they could hold horrifically racist views - and express them - without having any specific intent.

Similarly, someone could make a racist joke with the clear, conscious intent to be funny, but they're still being racist.

It's not about intent.

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videoamp1969
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 122

in reply to themorgan:

Correct

2019TIC - Tatooed Banjos-
2019TIC - Kitty Gorls-
2019 TIC - The Thirteen-
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2018 TIC - The Thirteen-"An Unfortunate Development"
2018 TIC - Tattooed Banjos-"Installing"
2018 TIC - Silver Stars-"The Black Phantom"
2017 TIC - Round Table Productions- "???"
2017
TIC - The Three Shushes- "Damsel"
2017 TIC - Lame Name- "Logan the Bogan" (3rd Audience Favourite)
2017 TIC - Pingkee and The Pitts- "Fierce"
2016 TIC - Team Wannab- "Strings Attached" (City Winner -Spirit of the Competition Award. Nominated for; Best Make Up, Best School Team)
2016
TIC - Af Rican Good Time- "Guess Who?" (2nd Audience Favourite, Nominated for, Best School Team)
2016
TIC - Abra Cadaver- "Charlie's Psychosis" (2nd Audience Favourite)
2016
TIC - The Rowing Team "Wool they wake up?"
2015 TIC - Tanfastic- "Command"
2015 TIC - The Darkest Timeline- "Walking in Pain"
2014 TIC - Vatican Daycare- "Slumber" (Audience Favourite, Nominated for;
Best Cinematography, Rialto Rising Talent, Best School Team)

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2014 TIC - Chookie- "The Diary of Morgan Foster"
2013 TIC - Procrasti Nation- "Joker" (City Winner - Incredibly Strange Best Bad Film)
2013 TIC - 2 Cameras 1 Film- "The Way Forward?" (Audience Favourite)
2013 TIC - Man Over The Fence- "Drama Queen"
2013 TIC - Is That Kaiapoi?!- "Inside The Mind"
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2012 TIC - Stickey Fingers- "Before the devil knows ur dead"
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2011 TIC -The Filthy Ninjas- "Burden of our Memories"
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Shifty
From: Oamaru
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 874

Well I applaud these guys.
Knowingly or unknowingly (I suspect the latter) they have created debate and debate within society is a good thing.
Now before you jump down my throat I'd like you read and think carefully about what I have to say.

there are some wider issues here.

Now let's just put aside the fact that it is poorly made techically, forget that it's of no relevence.

For a start you have to define racizm before you can label as such. Racizm by any dictionary meaning is the innate belief that one race is superior to another and has an emphasis on discrimination and denegration.

Racizm has nothing to do with colour, if it did it'd be called Colourizm. Racial stereotyping in humour, or in this case attemped humour, has been an accepted part of society for a long time. Who here hasn't told an Irish joke? the Irish are a race of people, The Celts, and yet we have accepted humour at their expense without question. So if we say that is okay to taunt the Irish then what does it say about us?

If in that film the roles were completely reversed i.e a dark skinned person with white makeup would it still be racizm, if we say yes then you'd have to conclude it is however if we say no then again what does it say about us.

there are also some much wider issues. To me i find it abhorant that a center of learning has taken a unilateral decision on what amounts to freedom of speech, something as a democracy we hold dear.
To me film is a branch of art and to begin censorship of art in a place of learning is in my opinion coming very close to fascizm. remember i'm not talking quality but content.
Art is about looking at ourselves and good art has always forced examination of our perceptions, so if institutionalized doctorine is going to start deciding what is acceptable in that regard what does that say about ourselves?

I notice a point that no one here has touched on and in the statement from the school also nothing was mentioned and that was the role of the, for want of a better phrase, "white skank" in the film who was there for no other purpose but sex and as a sex object. Surely that is blatant sexizm yet goes uncommented on so what does that tell us about ourselves?

It is also interesting that in the article no reference was made to the school taking advice from a source like the Race Relations office or perhaps the Maori Party. it would have been a very easy matter to let the film proceed to the next stage but the organizers asked to hold it back till the final heat while they got advice from a third intrested party.

now judging by the avatars, and it is all I have to go on, all the comments are from white males saying that it is racist to dark skinned people. has a single one of you actually asked a dark skinned person what they think and if they feel it is racist toward them?
If not are you in fact taking a superior high ground and telling dark skinned people you know better and how they should feel about this, if you haven't then what does that say about you?

the last question you need to examine, if that institution had not said a word, if no comment about that film had been made and it just went through, would there be any debate?
if not then you need to examine how you interpret life. Is a rubber stamp from an institution all it takes for something to be accepted?

I have seen far worse on the Simpsons and South Park and yet on it goes. Let's face it, two white guys write the part of Chef in South Park, are you not disgusted, if not what does it say about you ?

Now before you tell me to stop overthinking a badly mde bit of film. This and all these questions have been something that has been floating about in my skull for a little while, it is the basis for a script I'm formulating.
I gave a quick overview of it to someone and got a very negative reaction and I thought to myself I'm on the right track. trouble is i don't think there'd be a directer in the country with the balls to take it on but I will write it anyway, if nothing more than an exercise in self examination and at least I am prepared to do that.

2013 - Nimlin Productions - Full House - Obsessive Relationship Movie
2012 - Nimlin Productions - Hira's Tree - Urban Legend
2011 - Divide That By 9 - No Country For Fake Women - Crime
2010 - Off To The Accountant Films - The Meek Shall Inherit - Twin Movie - Regional Finalist
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dmanthei
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 418

Racizm

You lost me.

2014 - Robocrop - "Pads of Passion" RomCom (Best Original Score - Christchurch)
2013 - Robocrop - "The Price of Pilsner" Horror
2012 - Robocrop - "Promises" Crime - DQed (Nominated Best DQed Film)
2011 - Robocrop - "Protocol" One Room (Crime) - LATE
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videoamp1969
From: Christchurch
Since: May 2011
Posts: 122

in reply to Shifty:

I know I said I was going to let sleeping dogs lie, but I have been forced to comment.
Shifty that is probably the weakest, most pathetic, irresponsible, 1950's attitude, argument I have heard. Even by purposely spelling the word wrong (I presume for comic effect?) is demeaning. And to suggest I have to be black to be offended, what are you for real? Oh and please the old swap roles and is it racist then argument, are you serious? I honestly hope you are trying to be funny and have failed miserably (which in itself is offensive) and these are not your actual thoughts, if so you are in serious need of some education.

2019TIC - Tatooed Banjos-
2019TIC - Kitty Gorls-
2019 TIC - The Thirteen-
2019 TIC - Girls-
2019 TIC - Fresh Prince of Bel Air-
2019 TIC - Round Table Productions-
2019 Editor - Nang Sun-
2018 Editor - The Reality Wizards-"Speak Up"
2018 TIC - Titanic Swim Team-"Balloon"
2018 TIC - Utopia Studios-"The Game of Life"
2018 TIC - Round Table Productions-"Death by Natural Causes"
2018 TIC - The Thirteen-"An Unfortunate Development"
2018 TIC - Tattooed Banjos-"Installing"
2018 TIC - Silver Stars-"The Black Phantom"
2017 TIC - Round Table Productions- "???"
2017
TIC - The Three Shushes- "Damsel"
2017 TIC - Lame Name- "Logan the Bogan" (3rd Audience Favourite)
2017 TIC - Pingkee and The Pitts- "Fierce"
2016 TIC - Team Wannab- "Strings Attached" (City Winner -Spirit of the Competition Award. Nominated for; Best Make Up, Best School Team)
2016
TIC - Af Rican Good Time- "Guess Who?" (2nd Audience Favourite, Nominated for, Best School Team)
2016
TIC - Abra Cadaver- "Charlie's Psychosis" (2nd Audience Favourite)
2016
TIC - The Rowing Team "Wool they wake up?"
2015 TIC - Tanfastic- "Command"
2015 TIC - The Darkest Timeline- "Walking in Pain"
2014 TIC - Vatican Daycare- "Slumber" (Audience Favourite, Nominated for;
Best Cinematography, Rialto Rising Talent, Best School Team)

2014 TIC - Proximity- "Relapse"
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2013 TIC - Procrasti Nation- "Joker" (City Winner - Incredibly Strange Best Bad Film)
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2011 TIC -The Filthy Ninjas- "Burden of our Memories"
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